HH reborn sugestions 5/5: various fixes and balances

[MaxBlue01]

Since HH's forums are glitched for months, i guess i will invade Eliatopia's forum again for this. Here i propose various suggestion that can help fix more parts of the game to improve the overall experience for the players.

TL DR (because reading skill issue):

1) fixing fairy ville's secret area (from the training grounds)
2) fixing bouncer's cave secret area
3) not forgetting to add coinboxes (both in secret areas and in the normal world)
4) more farming areas for certain enemies: green walker, yellow puff monster, aipster
5) fixing enemies overall threat progression to avoid gaps in power and very tedious grinding.
6) nerfing mushroom squish's attack
7) reworking yellow puff monster
8) nerfing bouncing mushroom's movement
9) nerfing orange crazy / pumpkin creeper's attack
10) fixing teleporting enemies from lag
11) reducing large cluster of enemies
12) fixing shops overall progression + potential new shop area
13) few gun weapons fixes
14) (edited 20 september) fixing value of coin boxes
15) (edited 18 october) fixing chasing enemy AI
16) (edited 18 october) fixing a trading menu scam exploit

What is next is the details of each idea. I do NOT force anyone to read everything at once (there is a LOT to cover). It's fine to take some break, and check again later to read the rest. Anyway, here are my suggestions for HH reborn:

1) fairyville secret area is unfair, because one player have to sacrifice himself at the wood switch, while others have access to the secret. I think the wood switch should be a time based switch (like the yellow switches from the windmill area)

2) bouncer cave's secret content is very bad, compared to the need to break a tough rock (which require you to have enough power, which will usually 1 hit kill any red bouncer. By that point, you should have better areas to farm). The rock is useless in my opinion, and should be removed. Just keep the secret cave entrance, like the training ground's secret.

3) the patch notes mention "coin boxes" in secret areas, but i only saw them in the beach secret area (which i'm not sure if it's bugged, or if there is a very obscure way of reaching it). Don't forget to add those boxes in other secrets areas. I also think having "natural" coin boxes in the entire environemnt (like in original helmet heroes) is also a good idea, to prevent few players "camping" the secret areas for the boxes.

4) few enemies have too few areas to be farmed: green walker, yellow puff monster, aipster. i think there should be one (or even two) more area for them. This is especially true for the yellow puff monster. Right now, too many players are farming them, considering how easy they are. This make grinding very annoying and slow.

5) speaking of enemies progression, i feel it's currently unbalanced. While the yellow puff monsters *can* hit fairly hard at low-mid level, it is also laughably easy to avoid their attacks, compared to any other monster of similar threat. This make most lvl 20-50 players farming them and only them, causing lot of players to be on the same spots. On the other hand, the bouncing mushroom, the orange crazy, the pumpkin creeper are MUCH more dangerous, for very similar XP, making them worthless to fight (unless some hidden OP loot, which make it unfair anyway). There should be a main progression on which enemies the players can fight after a REASONABLE progression (no, waiting 30 very long levels to fight a new enemy shouldn't be normal). This include balancing both the damage the enemies deal, the defence they have, their HP, and the XP they gain. The general idea should be: the more you level up, the stronger you get, you can fight stronger enemies, which in turn will give you MORE xp and coins, allowing you to progress at a reasonable rate. Also, it is a bad design to have every enemies giving the same amount of coins AND exp. Considering how expensive the gear get, enemies should drop a lot more coins.

6) the mushroom squish (in the red mushroom forest) are a bit too strong for new players, especially considering the missile spam when several are close to eachother. I think they should only shoot 1 mushoom missile at a time, with a fairly long cooldown period between 2 missiles. Also, the missiles should only aim at the player for very few seconds (like 2 seconds) before vanishing / self-destructing (which does NOT deal damage)

7) i think the yellow puff monster is a bit too easy to beat, compared to the xp it give. I think increase his defence a little, and change his attack. Instead of an electric ring attack, let him charge (for around 1 sec) an electric shot, that will fire toward the player in a straight line (a bit slower than an archer's arrow shot). Players that are far enough can physically dodge the electric shot.

8) the bouncing mushroom enemies are extremly annoying to hit, because of their near constant movement and bounces. I suggest to make them a longer pause on the ground between bounces

9) i think the orange crazy's attack are way too frequent, forcing players to either attack from very far, or be forced to tank lot of attacks. I think they should only shoot one water jet every around 3 seconds. I think pumpkin creeper have a similar problem too.

10) in rare cases, some enemies are out of sync with the server (i think), causing them to sometimes suddenly teleport (usually on top of the player). A notable exemple is when fighting yellow puff monsters at low-mid level. Even if you are visually at a very safe distance when the monster do his electric attack, it is still possible for that monster to suddenly teleport to you, effectively hitting you (and usually kill you) suddenly, with no possible way of dodging it. This can be very unfair while grinding, and suddenly losing most of the grinded money just because of lag.

11) there are several areas with an abnormal number of enemies, usually more than players can handle when first visiting. I suggest to reduce the total number of monsters in certain areas:

training grounds: there is an area where new players are forced to go through several green walkers, which can be dangerous for them (keep in mind they cant save their money at this point. And the bouncer cave isn't better)

fairville (around middle area between training ground entrance and houses): there is a possible large group of yellow hairy monsters near a spring next to a giant vertical wall. This part can be very tough for new players who want to save their money, since currently, ALL their attacks will stack together, which will quickly lead new players to die.

red mushroom forest, the very left side of the forest, causing new players who explore to face tons of "mushroom missiles" at once

red mushroom forest, to the left of the 1st elevator, several mushroom squish are camping there, making the use of the elevator tricky for new players (if they are just strong enough, unless someone else is using the elevator)

red mushroom forest, a little to the right of the elevator to blue mushroom area. there is a TON of mushroom squish, which usually result in a "mushroom missiles" spam. Those mushroom missiles are near impossible to dodge

beach, there is like 1-2 main large areas with a bit too many crabs. When they stack in front of eachother, they can very quickly kill low gear players

note: there is likely more areas like those in mid-high level area, where too many monsters are at one place. Usually, it happen with bad slope physics (preventing enemies from climing slopes) or enemies falling into another enemy group.



12) i want to discuss shops items in general. There is currently 4 main shops areas. I will first summarize the min/max lvl for each gear type for each class, for each shop. Then i will share my overall opinion and suggestions for each shop.

training grounds:
warrior: weapons lvl 2-23, helmet lvl 1-34, armor/legs lvl 2-14, shoes lvl 1-12
mage: weapons lvl 1-20, helmet lvl 2-19, armor/legs lvl 2-16, shoes lvl 1-7
cowboy: weapons lvl 3-24 (very limited options), helmet lvl 1-20, armor/legs lvl 2-20, shoes lvl 1-7
archer: weapons lvl 2-23, helmet lvl 1-25, armor/legs lvl 2-25, shoes lvl 1-13

opinion: By the time you reach around lvl 20, you will want to save your money at fairyville. This make pointless to have lvl 20+ gear at training grounds. I think max lvl gear should be around lvl 15. Cowboys also need a bit more weapon variety for early game, even if it is made up guns (like a tomato gun, stone gun, ...). More notably, the training grounds have very high lvl warrior helmet, which make no sense for the progression.


fairy ville:
warrior: weapons lvl 24-58, helmet lvl 40-52, armor/legs lvl 35-44, shoes lvl 25
mage: weapons lvl 27-50, helmet lvl 12-32, armor/legs lvl 16-44, shoes lvl 1-12
cowboy: weapons lvl 30-54, helmet lvl 23-38, armor/legs lvl 26 (only 1), shoes lvl 19
archer: weapons lvl 31-46, helmet lvl 11-47, armor/legs lvl 2-14, no shoes

opinion: CURRENTLY, in order to reach the next shop (mushroom village), you will need to have enough power (to activate the elevators in red mushroom forest). Unless you stacked most stats on defence, this should be doable at around lvl 20-35. For me, any gear above lvl 35 shouldnt be in fairyville, but in mushroom village instead. There is also a few low level gear that would be better to have in training ground instead (especially for mage and archer). There is also a problem with the shoes very limited selection, jumping from around lvl 20 all the way to around lvl 50 in the next shop. I feel there should be 1 more shoe for all class between them (even 2 more shoes for archer, and 1 stronger shoes for mage)


mushroom village:
warrior: weapons lvl 63-96, helmet lvl 58-100, armor/legs lvl 79-100, shoes lvl 59-64
mage: weapons lvl 58-85, helmet lvl 40-95, armor/legs lvl 64-96, shoes lvl 48-58
cowboy: weapons lvl 59-103, helmet lvl 65-77 (surprisingly, "army helmet" is for archer, not for cowboy), armor/legs lvl 65-77, shoes lvl 44
archer: weapons lvl 54-98, helmet lvl 65-97, armor/legs lvl 67-95, shoes lvl 44-60

opinion: with the above opinions, i think lvl 35+ gear should start showing there. The real issue is handling very high level gear, since currently, the next "main" shop is at pablo's house, which require players to go through plant monsters and great frogs, which can be a major threat for a long time. For me, mushroom village should have lvl 35-60 gear, and there should be another main shop for lvl 60-90 gear. I'm thinking of 2 possible locations: 1) fill the haunted forest's house as a new shop (at the far right). 2) at the right end of the "windmill" area (like windy ridge's shop in original helmet heroes)


pablo house:
warrior: weapons lvl 113-148, helmet lvl 108-160, armor/legs lvl 108-152, shoes lvl 90
mage: weapons lvl 105-140, helmet lvl 100-138, armor/legs lvl 112-138, shoes lvl 68-85
cowboy: weapons lvl 95-126, helmet lvl 90-127, armor/legs lvl 90-121, shoes lvl 66
archer: weapons lvl 118-137, helmet lvl 114-139, armor/legs lvl 139, shoes lvl 88

opinion: cowboy suffer a little for not having high level gear (compared to other classes), while warrior have some very high level gear (much higher than other classes). great frogs can also enter the house, which can screw players from shopping


others shop notes: watermelon should be availible at mushroom village too. Pablo house should have bananas too.



13) currently, the guns "choices" aren't well designed. At low-mid level (between lvl 24 and 59), we only have 1-handed guns, while at mid-high level (between lvl 64 and 94; as well as between lvl 95 and 126), we only have (few) 2-handed guns. There is also very few weapon choices for very early levels (no 1-handed gun below lvl 24). This force players to do specific playstyles during their adventure. There should be more variety, more types of weapons, at any range of level. As for the gun's power, they seem to progress nicely, up to the lvl 59 candy pistol (with 2 of these: 12 540 possible damage per minute). But then, the next few guns are weaker (coin gun do 10 920 dmg/min, shotgun do 11 615 dmg/min). The next better gun would be the lvl 78 gangster gun, doing 13 950 dmg/min. This weapon is almost 20 levels above the candy pistol, which is a lot. The lvl 95 mini rifle also seem extremly strong (with 2 guns: do 19 740 dmg / min). Only the lvl 125 solar blaster (21 160 dmg/min) and 2 x lvl 126 solar pistol (26 000 dmg/min) are stronger than 2 mini rifle. That's 30 levels above. Finally, i feel having 2 1-handed weapons seem stronger than having a 2-handed weapon (like for the solar weapons). Like Eliatopia, there are other things to consider: attack stat (although it should work the same way for any gun) and enemy defence (low damage bullets will be less effective against enemies with strong defence, even if your gun have a high RPM).

14) right now, the coin boxes at the beach offer about 20K+ coins everytime. That's a LOT of money (and by that, i mean: too much money for the difficulty of the area). Despite being an area with just crabs, there is still too many high level players camping those area just for the coin boxes. It is a severe design flaw that grinding / camping coin boxes is MUCH more worth than farming enemies. Coins boxes should just be an extra income help, not the main way of getting money (and no, items drops is not consistent enough to be viable). I think the coin boxes total value should match the area difficulty, or is based on recommended gear / level for the area. Ex: training grounds: 500 total coins, beach: between 2 500 and 5 000 total coins (by total coins, i mean if we add all the coins from all the coin boxes). I also proposed in another discussion about a coin box system rework that can prevent camping and stealing.

15) i'm seeing several players using their high lvl alts to "manipulate" enemy AI to fall through platform ledges, by having their high def alt standing still at the very edge of a platform, making enemies unable to attack them without falling. This basically make a farming cheese by allowing players to create bigger group of enemies in one place. This exploit promote having multiple alt accounts in the same area. Exemple of this exploit include orange crazy (especially at the far right), horned monster, and plant monsters. Here is how to fix this exploit: improve the chasing AI by making them unable to fall through platforms (like: they see they will fall, so they will turn back immediately). We also need to think about being able to reliably attack players that are on the platform's edge. Like making enemies stop just close enough to the edge to hit players that are on the same platform.

16) i don't know if there are other "technical" exploits thatcan be used in the trading menu (not counting player's innatention, like putting wrong coin amount). But here is one i realised. Let's say player A claim to sell knight boots for 100K coins to player B, and player B agrees (regardless if it's a good or bad trade for either of them). In the trade menu, player B type "100 000" in coins FIRST. Then, player A can insert a boot item and QUICKLY press confirm. At that point, player B have no certain way of checking what item is offered by player A, because he is unable to click the item. Player B have 2 option: either he blindly trust player A and accept the offer, or he can close the trade window (which cancel the current trade), then ask player A to not be too fast / force player A to put his item first. Because of this trading exploit, there is nothing stopping player A from swapping a non existent "knight boots" for cheap "white shoes". Meaning player B would buy cheap white shoes... for 100K. While there isn't a lot of exemples like this, players need to be careful about 2 similar looking items (especially boots, which have very low details). The fix is very easy: allow players to check the items even after someone made the 1st confirmation. Or force a short timer when anyone change his offer before being able to confirm. Also maybe make the coins amount better (showing "100 000" instead of "100000", so it's easier to count the "0", which make getting scammed with very high money value much harder)

[MaxBlue01]

As a reminder: i am NOT forcing everyone to "agree" with me on every suggestions. If you have a question, an improvement, or you see a problem with one of my suggestions, feel free to add to the discussion (i added numbers to my suggestions for a reason). However, if you do have a problem with a sugestion / or if you strongly disagree, i expect you to give me a good explanation. Saying "this sugestion is bad" doesn't help anyone.